What might a new Star Trek series look like in the REAL Prime Timeline?

[Overmind One]

We want Star Trek back. Not fake Trek like Discovery or any of the Abrams/Kelvin/Kurtzman crap, but actual Star Trek. We have The Orville which is the closest thing to it right now, but nothing from CBS looks like Star Trek at the moment. I think that as long as Kurtzman is at the helm, we are not going to be able to get Star Trek back for a few years. Why? Because it is beyond his abilities to create it. He does fantasy/magic, not science fiction. He was the wrong person for the job and CBS will find out the hard way and millions of dollars later. Axanar would have made a great start. Even the showrunners of Star Trek Continues would have done a better job.

 

[PussyGalore]

First they need to correct the weird issue between Paramount and CBS regarding ownership of ST. Then they need to get the hell out of the past and give us some completely new characters and stories that come after everything that's already been done. I don't want anymore prequels or reboots or alt-universe story lines. That shit is just plain stupid.

And yes, I want clearly defined good guys and bad guys. I want heroes and heroines. I don't want any protagonists with mental problems. I want characters that I can actually relate to. Period.

 

[Overmind One]

First they need to correct the weird issue between Paramount and CBS regarding ownership of ST. Then they need to get the hell out of the past and give us some completely new characters and stories that come after everything that's already been done. I don't want anymore prequels or reboots or alt-universe story lines. That shit is just plain stupid.

And yes, I want clearly defined good guys and bad guys. I want heroes and heroines. I don't want any protagonists with mental problems. I want characters that I can actually relate to. Period.

The bolded is a HUGE one. Without being able to use the visual aesthetic of any of the previous Star Trek shows, we lose the LCARS, all of the familiar ship designs, the Andorians and Ferengi and Cardassians and even the Borg. And the writing being so vastly different turns this space-based mosh pit into a whole different thing than Star Trek. Who are the enemies and who are the heroes?

 

[heisenberg]

We want Star Trek back. Not fake Trek like Discovery or any of the Abrams/Kelvin/Kurtzman crap, but actual Star Trek. We have The Orville which is the closest thing to it right now, but nothing from CBS looks like Star Trek at the moment. I think that as long as Kurtzman is at the helm, we are not going to be able to get Star Trek back for a few years. Why? Because it is beyond his abilities to create it. He does fantasy/magic, not science fiction. He was the wrong person for the job and CBS will find out the hard way and millions of dollars later. Axanar would have made a great start. Even the showrunners of Star Trek Continues would have done a better job.

I have all but given up on Star Trek and the vision that roddenberry carried with it. He knew from the get go that getting a world that he has envisioned is a fantasy which is why you don't see this type of world.
This is why we are not getting good science fiction shows anymore. The writers are deeply hurt by what has happened to planet earth and our species but they fear of speaking out creatively because they know they are going to be judged/ridiculed or mocked or the fact that they know that a future Utopian world does not exist


The fact is that the world is run by real criminal. You know, the Men in suits that are narcissist/sociopaths, that run wallstreet and the sharemarket who are getting away with murder and the crimes to humanity and planet earth.

Unfortunately, mother nature never makes them suffer. Instead, it is you and that have to suffer because of their actions and it's going to continue that way because the game of life is rigged and how they always need a bit more and can't have enough so they keep licking the bowl until there is not a proton left on the bowl.

It's this sick mentality that will be the down fall of the human race, and makes you wish you weren't born at all. To me, life is not a blessing but a curse, but oh, now they'll have robots doing our work for us, so our pay will drop more. Meanwhile prices of goods will increase.

 

[Overmind One]

I have all but given up on Star Trek and the vision that roddenberry carried with it. He knew from the get go that getting a world that he has envisioned is a fantasy which is why you don't see this type of world.
This is why we are not getting good science fiction shows anymore. The writers are deeply hurt by what has happened to planet earth and our species but they fear of speaking out creatively because they know they are going to be judged/ridiculed or mocked or the fact that they know that a future Utopian world does not exist


The fact is that the world is run by real criminal. You know, the Men in suits that are narcissist/sociopaths who are getting away with murder and the crimes to humanity and planet earth.

Unfortunately, mother nature never makes them suffer. Instead, it is you and that have to suffer because of their actions and it's going to continue that way because the game of life is rigged and how they always need a bit more and can't have enough so they keep licking the bowl until there is not a proton left on the bowl.

It's this sick mentality that will be the down fall of the human race, and makes you wish you weren't born at all. To me, life is not a blessing but a curse, but oh, now they'll have robots doing our work for us, so our pay will drop more. Meanwhile prices of goods will increase.

Star Trek was conceived to be the future of Mankind AFTER the fall of capitalism, of nation-states, of tribalism. In Roddenberry's vision, robots had not taken over the world, corporations did not own space or the ships or have patents on the tech. It was all considered the domain of all humans. It was a meritocracy. There is nothing fantastical about this sort of human society, it is the inevitable result of cooperation. We cannot have cooperation as long as there are nation-states, capitalism and divisions in society. The things you mention would have been part of pre-WWIII society in Roddenberry's vision. Modern day problems like capitalism and greed are standing in the way of efforts being made by companies such as SpaceX and Tesla. Greed and control are stifling the widespread use of solar for individuals, local wind power (built into homes and multi-family dwellings), and renewable fuel sources cutting out the suppliers. The organic garbage of a neighborhood could be converted into ethanol and methane to serve that neighborhood EASILY. But greed has mobilized forces against these things through legislation and sabotage.

 

[heisenberg]

Star Trek was conceived to be the future of Mankind AFTER the fall of capitalism, of nation-states, of tribalism. In Roddenberry's vision, robots had not taken over the world, corporations did not own space or the ships or have patents on the tech. It was all considered the domain of all humans. It was a meritocracy. There is nothing fantastical about this sort of human society, it is the inevitable result of cooperation. We cannot have cooperation as long as there are nation-states, capitalism and divisions in society. The things you mention would have been part of pre-WWIII society in Roddenberry's vision. Modern day problems like capitalism and greed are standing in the way of efforts being made by companies such as SpaceX and Tesla. Greed and control are stifling the widespread use of solar for individuals, local wind power (built into homes and multi-family dwellings), and renewable fuel sources cutting out the suppliers. The organic garbage of a neighborhood could be converted into ethanol and methane to serve that neighborhood EASILY. But greed has mobilized forces against these things through legislation and sabotage.

Those companies maybe changing the world but we are stuck with banks who control everything in the world. Sorry but I don't see this filth and disease going away anytime soon. Amazon is just as guilty of this as is everyone.

 

[Overmind One]

Those companies maybe changing the world but we are stuck with banks who control everything in the world. Sorry but I don't see this filth and disease going away anytime soon. Amazon is just as guilty of this as is everyone.

A nuclear world war would do it quickly.

 

[heisenberg]

A nuclear world war would do it quickly.

Yeah, except I don't want one thanks. I already hear about blood shed as it is, asking for more isn't the answer.

 

[Atlantis]

We want Star Trek back. Not fake Trek like Discovery or any of the Abrams/Kelvin/Kurtzman crap, but actual Star Trek. We have The Orville which is the closest thing to it right now, but nothing from CBS looks like Star Trek at the moment. I think that as long as Kurtzman is at the helm, we are not going to be able to get Star Trek back for a few years. Why? Because it is beyond his abilities to create it. He does fantasy/magic, not science fiction. He was the wrong person for the job and CBS will find out the hard way and millions of dollars later. Axanar would have made a great start. Even the showrunners of Star Trek Continues would have done a better job.

I am just curious to know. Is there a reason why you posted a topic for it? Couldn't you have posted your views on the show in the STD sucks topic?

 

[Overmind One]

Yeah, except I don't want one thanks. I already hear about blood shed as it is, asking for more isn't the answer.

Those in power are never going to willingly give it up. Their thinking patterns are not only good with being a hoarding, self-absorbed narcissist, but their motivations are all self-serving and not at all concerned with others. Unlike people like Alfred Nobel and other genuine philanthropists, the simply wealthy are just bastards. Most of the super wealthy in America got that way by some means of inheritance. Others made it big, but do not share. At the root of it all is capitalism.

 

[Overmind One]

I am just curious to know. Is there a reason why you posted a topic for it? Couldn't you have posted your views on the show in the STD sucks topic?

Well, this isn't just about STD. It will apply to all of the "Star Trek" created by Kurtzman or Abrams or anyone moving in the direction of that Kelvin/action film direction. STD sucks, yes. But probably so will the Picard series.

 

[PussyGalore]

I am just curious to know. Is there a reason why you posted a topic for it? Couldn't you have posted your views on the show in the STD sucks topic?

I think the question OM1 asks is more abstract than just commentary on STD. As it is they've announced that they're keeping Kurtzman in charge of the Trek franchise which means we can expect more of the same garbage in the other shows that he does.

 

[PussyGalore]

Well, this isn't just about STD. It will apply to all of the "Star Trek" created by Kurtzman or Abrams or anyone moving in the direction of that Kelvin/action film direction. STD sucks, yes. But probably so will the Picard series.

If the Picard series is at all good it will be because they've now been put on notice that the public doesn't want "Star Trek-in-name-only" garbage. Regardless, I don't trust Kurtzman to respect the character of Picard enough to do it justice. No doubt we'll get some weird crap that makes Jean Luc look pathetic or dumb or something like that. Clearly asking for a solid Star Trek show is expecting too much of Kurtzman's limited abilities. If this was a reboot of Xena or Hercules he'd probably do just fine but the man clearly doesn't know Trek and shouldn't be at the helm.

 

[Overmind One]

I think the question OM1 asks is more abstract than just commentary on STD. As it is they've announced that they're keeping Kurtzman in charge of the Trek franchise which means we can expect more of the same garbage in the other shows that he does.

FIVE YEARS. That is how long they have given them. Good thing is that with all the breaks they take and delays that happen, five years will go by pretty quickly. Time enough for Discovery to die, for the Picard series to be produced and then die. If by some miracle the original aesthetic returns, we will have to still worry about the writing. These hacks are completely missing the mark, and the agendas they have decided to focus on are pathetically present day. This is supposed to be taking place a couple hundred of years from now. These writers would rather focus on the interactions of the crew than explore new worlds and civilizations. The "villians" are cartoonish and juvenile. Even the silly stories of Captain Proton in Voyager were more complex.

 

[PussyGalore]

FIVE YEARS. That is how long they have given them. Good thing is that with all the breaks they take and delays that happen, five years will go by pretty quickly. Time enough for Discovery to die, for the Picard series to be produced and then die. If by some miracle the original aesthetic returns, we will have to still worry about the writing. These hacks are completely missing the mark, and the agendas they have decided to focus on are pathetically present day. This is supposed to be taking place a couple hundred of years from now. These writers would rather focus on the interactions of the crew than explore new worlds and civilizations. The "villians" are cartoonish and juvenile. Even the silly stories of Captain Proton in Voyager were more complex.

Earlier you posted a link to the battle scene between Discovery and the Klingon coffin ship. I honestly tried to watch it objectively and not with an anti-STD attitude. Still, it was really bad. It just was not Star Trek.

The live-action camera work was bad. The tech was really bad (spore drive and spinning yo yo's -- are you kidding me?). The acting was clunky and conveyed no tension. This is not how Star Trek should be portrayed. Seriously, this production is heavily flawed.

 

[Joelist]

And remember that Captain Proton was SUPPOSED to be silly and campy. But it was still entertaining and even had Trek concepts in it. Bride of Chaotica was very rewatchable and Kate Mulgrew as Queen Arachnia was having a blast vamping it up.

 

[Overmind One]

I thought this was interesting.

 

[Overmind One]

I watched parts of some of the Discovery episodes again today. Seriously, it's just bad right down to the scene level. The dialogue is flat and the scenes feel scripted and forced. Seriously, I wanted to get whatever they are trying to do with this show, and all I see is Kurtzman continuing to shape his vision for a show taking place on a starship filled with what he thinks are interesting characters. These characters each represent a social justice agenda, and the episodes center around the interactions of the characters. Everything else is just a backdrop. Since exploration and science have no relevance in his vision, you don't see it in the show. The effects are supposed to make up for that. Kurtzman literally took the "Trek" out of Star Trek with that asinine spore drive nonsense. There is nowhere on the ship which feels like a quiet place to think or relax, where you can see the stars passing at warp while thoughtful dialogue helps flesh out a story. That's because there is no real story.

Take a look...


What the hell? So much fail in only 1min 53sec. And that is just Discovery. The fail started in 2009.

 

[PussyGalore]

I watched parts of some of the Discovery episodes again today. Seriously, it's just bad right down to the scene level. The dialogue is flat and the scenes feel scripted and forced. Seriously, I wanted to get whatever they are trying to do with this show, and all I see is Kurtzman continuing to shape his vision for a show taking place on a starship filled with what he thinks are interesting characters. These characters each represent a social justice agenda, and the episodes center around the interactions of the characters. Everything else is just a backdrop. Since exploration and science have no relevance in his vision, you don't see it in the show. The effects are supposed to make up for that. Kurtzman literally took the "Trek" out of Star Trek with that asinine spore drive nonsense. There is nowhere on the ship which feels like a quiet place to think or relax, where you can see the stars passing at warp while thoughtful dialogue helps flesh out a story. That's because there is no real story.

Exactly, there is no "life" to this show, it's just a bunch of gimmicky Star Trek memes presented as plot.

And the acting is atrocious. Seriously, it's bad. Whoever the actress is that is playing the Admiral needs to do prison time for her performance. It's downright criminal. I felt absolutely nothing in response to her character. All I felt was myself being pulled out of the show and marveling at just how bad of an actress she is. That isn't how acting is supposed to work. The job of the actor is to make the viewers believe the character they are watching. The only thing this talent-less bitch made me believe is that she shouldn't be in front of a camera picking up a paycheck for acting when she's clearly incapable of performing the job she's been hired for.

Additionally, the direction in this show is heavy handed and flows with all the subtlety of a concrete pour at a construction site -- plop plop plop.

 

[Overmind One]

Exactly, there is no "life" to this show, it's just a bunch of gimmicky Star Trek memes presented as plot.

And the acting is atrocious. Seriously, it's bad. Whoever the actress is that is playing the Admiral needs to do prison time for her performance. It's downright criminal. I felt absolutely nothing in response to her character. All I felt was myself being pulled out of the show and marveling at just how bad of an actress she is. That isn't how acting is supposed to work. The job of the actor is to make the viewers believe the character they are watching. The only thing this talent-less bitch made me believe is that she shouldn't be in front of a camera picking up a paycheck for acting when she's clearly incapable of performing the job she's been hired for.

Additionally, the direction in this show is heavy handed and flows with all the subtlety of a concrete pour at a construction site -- plop plop plop.

View attachment 34585

I downloaded all the Season 1 episodes, and I can't bring myself to watch any of them all the way through. It's absolutely awful, and it gets more awful when you watch them longer than 15 min at a time.